Comments on: is HTML the new PL/SQL?

By: Jefotinu

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By: Wugilbeevi

Wugilbeevi — Mon, 14 Sep 2009 14:53:10 +0000

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By: Dimitris

Dimitris — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 12:19:02 +0000

JPA is useless outside the scope of JVM. Hibernate may have a .Net sibling, though here comes Microsoft offering their (completely different) thing. Ruby? there is ActiveRecord but you have to learn everything again. PHP? Perl? Python?

The point is that SQL is more universal than any kind of ORM will be.

By: Dino

Dino — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 11:08:53 +0000

Of course you need to know SQL. Contrary to the beliefs of some, we are going to use RDBMs for years to come. Unless we can get a perfect ORM that not only knows how to do joins efficently in all cases AND knows what columns that needs to be indexed, you need to learn SQL.

Key-value-stores have their place of course, so any good developer needs to know when to use which technology.

By: Raibaz

Raibaz — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 10:25:58 +0000

@Florian: you got the comparison wrong, it’s between GWT and ORMs, which actually translate object-oriented code in SQL.

Code translation from a higher abstraction level to a lower one happens since the first compiler and is the reason why we’re not writing assembler anymore.

You probably have a point in saying it’s suboptimal, and this is the reason why PL/SQL could survive in environments where optimization is crucial (exactly as environments who still use assembler), but the benefits of using a higher abstraction level are too big to be ignored just because of optimization.

@paulb: i totally agree, SQL is doomed for the majority of apps and will probably survive just in some inherently relational situations.

By: paulb

paulb — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 21:37:53 +0000

The ORM may be hot today… but tomorrow, the key-value-store or document-oriented database will be the new king. Many people will realize these approaches are a better fit for their needs than an ORM’d SQL.

Then you can write Part II of this article “Is today’s ORM the new HTML and PL/SQL”

Non-SQL systems will reign king soon. The ORM will lose attention as less people will use SQL systems.

Data impedance issues will cause SQL db’s and their ORM friends to lose market share. Not saying RDBMS will die, they are certainly the #1 fit for allot of situations. But a majority of apps are better fit for other database systems.

By: Florian

Florian — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 20:57:35 +0000

GWT & co. translate one set of programmatic and declarative amalgam to another, while SQL does not “translate” to PL/SQL in order to execute. The difference is subtle, but important.

It’s known that automatic translation from one programming language/API to another is always very… suboptimal in nature. All kinds of complexities get introduced and runtime suffers. Additionally, what is idiomatic, quick, effective etc. in one platform is probably none of those in the other.

You’re in effect suggesting, in all seriousness, that good applications built on good javascript frameworks will inevitably be replaced by inefficient code-generators that produce bloated applications that have neither elegance nor speed on their target platform. Hell, next you’ll be trying to sell software-factories to me.

By: Raibaz

Raibaz — Fri, 06 Mar 2009 16:03:05 +0000

As far as i can remember, you’re a black-belt Java coder, so you’re not a dinosaur

By: orla

orla — Fri, 06 Mar 2009 15:55:33 +0000

Am I a dinosaur?

:’(